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	<title>Comments on: Why Concurrency Matters</title>
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	<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/</link>
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		<title>By: Joe Rigby</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2650</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Rigby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 14:16:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2650</guid>
		<description>oops! http://mellanium13.blogspot.com/2009/11/come-one-come-all-take-load-off.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>oops! <a href="http://mellanium13.blogspot.com/2009/11/come-one-come-all-take-load-off.html" rel="nofollow">http://mellanium13.blogspot.com/2009/11/come-one-come-all-take-load-off.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Joe Rigby</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2649</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Rigby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Nov 2009 14:16:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2649</guid>
		<description>Hows about it then! Lets make it the 27th November at 12 NOON (EST)http://mellanium13.blogspot.com/2009/11/come-one-come-all-take-load-off.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hows about it then! Lets make it the 27th November at 12 NOON (EST)<a href="http://mellanium13.blogspot.com/2009/11/come-one-come-all-take-load-off.html" rel="nofollow">http://mellanium13.blogspot.com/2009/11/come-one-come-all-take-load-off.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ken</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2644</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 10:02:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2644</guid>
		<description>Joe;  We need to organise a mass crowd to test concurrency limits from many locations, say when and where!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe;  We need to organise a mass crowd to test concurrency limits from many locations, say when and where!</p>
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		<title>By: Ken</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2638</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 21:54:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2638</guid>
		<description>Virual Worlds should simulate the real world; with all the possibilities.  Some people like crowds, some don&#039;t.  Choice is the answer, let people decide what they want.  Just give them the choice.
Instant collaboration, information on tap, all in a 3D real-world simulation. No need to travel, work from home, with constant monitoring to ensure efficiency and effectiveness. No more silly e-mails on works time, no office politics, etc. Heaven for the Creatives?  Awful for the control freaks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Virual Worlds should simulate the real world; with all the possibilities.  Some people like crowds, some don&#8217;t.  Choice is the answer, let people decide what they want.  Just give them the choice.<br />
Instant collaboration, information on tap, all in a 3D real-world simulation. No need to travel, work from home, with constant monitoring to ensure efficiency and effectiveness. No more silly e-mails on works time, no office politics, etc. Heaven for the Creatives?  Awful for the control freaks!</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Rigby</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2637</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Rigby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 15:10:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2637</guid>
		<description>So let&#039;s assume concurrency does matter and that a single crowd of &gt;250 avatars interacting lag-free is an important capability. NORTEL has presented web.alive as such a platform for the Immersive Internet
http://www.linkedin.com/news?viewArticle=&amp;articleID=78296419&amp;gid=1990473&amp;srchCat=WOTC&amp;articleURL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eslideshare%2Enet%2Fjoe133952%2Fimmersive-internet&amp;urlhash=Zjcm
I approached NORTEL personnel and suggested that they would gain some kudos by allowing sufficient server bandwidth for a high concurrency on their APEX &quot;OFFICE COMPLEX&quot; www.apex.projectchainsaw.com and they laughed indignantly and stated categorically it would be impossible to attract enough visitors to ever significantly affect the performance of the site. Is this a opportunity to arrange for a mass influx to test their beta 2.0 client? I personally think that there are some individuals who understand both that web.alive could be a important step in the future development of the 3D web but also scuppers their present commitment to other platforms. I am often wrong however. Am I?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So let&#8217;s assume concurrency does matter and that a single crowd of &gt;250 avatars interacting lag-free is an important capability. NORTEL has presented web.alive as such a platform for the Immersive Internet<br />
<a href="http://www.linkedin.com/news?viewArticle=&#038;articleID=78296419&#038;gid=1990473&#038;srchCat=WOTC&#038;articleURL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eslideshare%2Enet%2Fjoe133952%2Fimmersive-internet&#038;urlhash=Zjcm" rel="nofollow">http://www.linkedin.com/news?viewArticle=&#038;articleID=78296419&#038;gid=1990473&#038;srchCat=WOTC&#038;articleURL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eslideshare%2Enet%2Fjoe133952%2Fimmersive-internet&#038;urlhash=Zjcm</a><br />
I approached NORTEL personnel and suggested that they would gain some kudos by allowing sufficient server bandwidth for a high concurrency on their APEX &#8220;OFFICE COMPLEX&#8221; <a href="http://www.apex.projectchainsaw.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.apex.projectchainsaw.com</a> and they laughed indignantly and stated categorically it would be impossible to attract enough visitors to ever significantly affect the performance of the site. Is this a opportunity to arrange for a mass influx to test their beta 2.0 client? I personally think that there are some individuals who understand both that web.alive could be a important step in the future development of the 3D web but also scuppers their present commitment to other platforms. I am often wrong however. Am I?</p>
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		<title>By: James Taylor</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2636</link>
		<dc:creator>James Taylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 08:30:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2636</guid>
		<description>I think I&#039;m on the fence on this one. I personally don&#039;t buy your arguments, but that&#039;s just it, it&#039;s a personal choice and I do think that the fairly arbitrary technical limits that exist right now will inevitably improve. Having said that, I&#039;d prefer a club with medium concurrency and a meeting with few enough people that there&#039;s at least half a chance of making a decision!

What I disagree most with though is the assertion that the whole point of using a 3D virtual space is its similarity to being in a physical space. To me that is another completely arbitrary limitation. Sure, people aren&#039;t going to leave familiar environments behind immediately since they help set the context of interactions but I hope we will gradually get beyond that to find better ways of working. Bob has it so right with his Mardi Gras example; the real world doesn&#039;t scale well either! Why recreate the overcrowding, queues, inconvenience etc. of a real event. Surely every seat in a virtual event should be a front row seat?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I&#8217;m on the fence on this one. I personally don&#8217;t buy your arguments, but that&#8217;s just it, it&#8217;s a personal choice and I do think that the fairly arbitrary technical limits that exist right now will inevitably improve. Having said that, I&#8217;d prefer a club with medium concurrency and a meeting with few enough people that there&#8217;s at least half a chance of making a decision!</p>
<p>What I disagree most with though is the assertion that the whole point of using a 3D virtual space is its similarity to being in a physical space. To me that is another completely arbitrary limitation. Sure, people aren&#8217;t going to leave familiar environments behind immediately since they help set the context of interactions but I hope we will gradually get beyond that to find better ways of working. Bob has it so right with his Mardi Gras example; the real world doesn&#8217;t scale well either! Why recreate the overcrowding, queues, inconvenience etc. of a real event. Surely every seat in a virtual event should be a front row seat?</p>
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		<title>By: Ken</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2635</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 17:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2635</guid>
		<description>Using a deFacto 3D engine like Unreal enables most of the processing to be done locally; only positional data of moving objects need to be sent via the internet.  The engine was designed to work on 2004 spec machines so most 3-4 year old machines have no problem; but things like anti-aliasing will probably not work to well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Using a deFacto 3D engine like Unreal enables most of the processing to be done locally; only positional data of moving objects need to be sent via the internet.  The engine was designed to work on 2004 spec machines so most 3-4 year old machines have no problem; but things like anti-aliasing will probably not work to well.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Flesch</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2632</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Flesch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 21:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2632</guid>
		<description>My 2 cents after creating virtual worlds for 10 years.

People want to be around people, but only with in limits. e.g. While in New Orleans for Mardi Gras I was on a street was SO crowded I literally couldn&#039;t move. The virtual world analogy is lag caused by the client trying to render too many avatars at once, particularly visible in SL due to the user generated content. The other down side to too many people in one area is that you can&#039;t interact with all of them. Chat scrolls by too quickly. I challenge someone to show me how having 1000 people in an area of a world adds any value. It sounds neat, but in balancing cost vs benefit, is it really there?

So the ideal situation is being around enough people to keep you interested, but not so many that your performance is seriously effected. Some worlds, of which Prototerra&#039;s platform was the first, create parallel dimensions. So if a region of the world gets over some defined population limit, the server does not assign new users to the region of the world. The server automagically create a new dimension (which looks exactly like the first) and users going into the area of the world are assigned to this parallel dimension. User can travel between dimensions if they choose, to join friends for example. And the server allows the population limit to be broken for dimension travel. So you can always be with your friends. 

I like to compare the SL way of doing it to a web site. Would eBay be in business if only 50 people could be on one of their web site at a time? Virtual worlds like websites need to scale scale scale. 

Prototerra&#039;s worlds have had thousands of people spread out simultaneously across multiple dimensions. And all of these user felt like they were in a full house. We also can assign people to dimension based on things like language, or region, so that all of the French speakers, and Turkish speakers can be in the same dimension.

Lots more could be said on this subject, but I will save it for another time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My 2 cents after creating virtual worlds for 10 years.</p>
<p>People want to be around people, but only with in limits. e.g. While in New Orleans for Mardi Gras I was on a street was SO crowded I literally couldn&#8217;t move. The virtual world analogy is lag caused by the client trying to render too many avatars at once, particularly visible in SL due to the user generated content. The other down side to too many people in one area is that you can&#8217;t interact with all of them. Chat scrolls by too quickly. I challenge someone to show me how having 1000 people in an area of a world adds any value. It sounds neat, but in balancing cost vs benefit, is it really there?</p>
<p>So the ideal situation is being around enough people to keep you interested, but not so many that your performance is seriously effected. Some worlds, of which Prototerra&#8217;s platform was the first, create parallel dimensions. So if a region of the world gets over some defined population limit, the server does not assign new users to the region of the world. The server automagically create a new dimension (which looks exactly like the first) and users going into the area of the world are assigned to this parallel dimension. User can travel between dimensions if they choose, to join friends for example. And the server allows the population limit to be broken for dimension travel. So you can always be with your friends. </p>
<p>I like to compare the SL way of doing it to a web site. Would eBay be in business if only 50 people could be on one of their web site at a time? Virtual worlds like websites need to scale scale scale. </p>
<p>Prototerra&#8217;s worlds have had thousands of people spread out simultaneously across multiple dimensions. And all of these user felt like they were in a full house. We also can assign people to dimension based on things like language, or region, so that all of the French speakers, and Turkish speakers can be in the same dimension.</p>
<p>Lots more could be said on this subject, but I will save it for another time.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Newstead</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2631</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Newstead</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 03:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2631</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s great to be in such a high concurrency area, but these new techniques have to be rock solid and efficient for it to be able to work well - not just polygons per second but also animation/skinning cycles and bandwidth for all the UGC, gracefully scaling down textures..  maybe it has been solved already but is seems to still be a tough engineering challenge on lower end machines, especially as they are also doing many other things at the same time (eg web platforms )</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s great to be in such a high concurrency area, but these new techniques have to be rock solid and efficient for it to be able to work well &#8211; not just polygons per second but also animation/skinning cycles and bandwidth for all the UGC, gracefully scaling down textures..  maybe it has been solved already but is seems to still be a tough engineering challenge on lower end machines, especially as they are also doing many other things at the same time (eg web platforms )</p>
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		<title>By: Ken</title>
		<link>http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/2009/10/19/why-concurrency-matters/comment-page-1/#comment-2630</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 09:08:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.calebbooker.com/blog/?p=1780#comment-2630</guid>
		<description>Optimising the ISP and Operating system to games mode; reduces lag and latency and increases frame rates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Optimising the ISP and Operating system to games mode; reduces lag and latency and increases frame rates.</p>
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